Section : Clutch

Clutch problem 

Posted By : Ben Duckett, 23-Mar-2004, 04:02pm

Hi,
Having actually taken Angelina out of the garage to start her up last night (success, the engine still works ) It was the clutch that wasn't playing ball. When the pedal is depressed there is no pressure and when trying to select a gear there is a generally horrible noise of metal grinding. Any suggestions, bearing in mind this is the first outing in five months? Would it be enough to bleed the clutch and refill the fluid? Thanks in advance for any suggestions!

• Clutch problem 

  Posted By : Mark Stradling, 23-Mar-2004, 04:44pm

  Any suggestions... well a length of 2x4 holding the clutch pedal down 5 months ago would have worked.
  
  Assuming there IS something in the clutch master cylinder (i.e the friction plate has stuck to the flywheel and it's not the slave cylinder seals that have gone and dumped all your hydraulic fluid on the floor as happened to me last time) then you can try some of the following.
  
  Put the engine in 1st and rock gentally. Basically the idea is to put a little shock loading through the gearbox and try and crack the seal between the friction plate and the flywheel. Don't overdo the loading though - don't want to damage that gearbox!
  
  If that doesn't work, start the engine (out of gear) and get the temperature up to normal levels, leave it running for a bit, then try putting into gear. The idea here is that the heat from the engine slowly warms up the flywheel which, being metal expands. This will sometimes break the seal with the friction plate (which doesn't expand with heat).
  
  If THAT doesn't work, well normally I've got bored and frustrated so get more heavy handed. Push the car out of the garage (if it's facing nose in), start the engine and just jab it in and out of gear a few times (with the clutch pedal down). This is applying a shock loading like the rocking, above... just a little more... violent.
  
  Mine has always freed up using one of the above... normally with much swaering about why I forgot to put the bit of wood on the pedal last time.... followed by me forgetting to put the bit of wood on the pedal before closing the garage.
  
  No, I never do learn.

  • Clutch problem 

    Posted By : Paul Bodiam, 23-Mar-2004, 05:00pm

    Mark wrote:
    
    "start the engine and just jab it in and out of gear a few times (with the clutch pedal down). This is applying a shock loading like the rocking, above... just a little more... violent."
    
    OUCH! Surely this risks damaging the gearbox?
    There is another method of applying a shock loading that I have found works and doesn't involve potential damage to the gearbox:
    
    After getting the engine (and flywheel) nice and hot, stop the engine and push the car clear of other cars, garage walls, etc. Sit in the car with the handbrake on, and the footbrake pressed firmly down, press the clutch down and select a gear. Keeping the clutch pedal pressed, start the engine. The starter usually has enough torque to free the clutch instantly.
    
    Hope this helps
    
    Paul
    

    • Clutch problem 

      Posted By : Mark Stradling, 23-Mar-2004, 05:27pm

      OUCH! Surely this risks damaging the gearbox?
      
      Yes, it does.
      
      This is only used at the point of desperation - had it happen a few times when my car has been stored, and only needed to resort to this once - was more a less a matter of move NOW or it gets sold with the house!

      • Clutch problem 

        Posted By : Ben Duckett, 23-Mar-2004, 07:47pm

        Thanks for all the advice, it's nice to know that I've not got the only car that takes the hump at being neglected for so long. I have got no idea which gorilla did up the top on the master cylinder but I couldn't the thing to budge. I' I'm going to get my Dad's oil filter wrench and 'persuade' it to come off! Can I assume my usual 'that'll only take half an hour' if I have to change the slave cylinder seals?
        Thanks in advance (as ever)
        Ben
        all round.

        • Clutch problem 

          Posted By : Dom Weaver, 23-Mar-2004, 07:58pm

          Well I used the "jab it in and out of gear with the engine running" method!!!
          
          The gearbox survived, but when i heard the noises it made i thought i'd ripped the gearbox apart! It was quite heart wrenching, I can tell you.
          
          This seems common on Triumphs, i've never heard of it on other cars ever.
          

          • Clutch problem 

            Posted By : Tim Everitt, 24-Mar-2004, 11:31am

            Glad you got it going. It's not that uncommon - particularly on pre-war cars with multi plate clutches. I've had it on a number of different cars over the years, particularly if they've been left for more than a year or so.

            • Clutch problem 

              Posted By : Andy Cook, 10-May-2004, 11:25pm

              Before I moved House a couple of years ago and got a nice garage workshop I used to have a problem wth a seized clutch on my GT6 as the garage at the old house was pretty damp.
              
              A couple of times when the car hadn't been used for sometime the clutch plate really seized pretty solidly onto the flywheel.
              
              The method I always used was to start and fully warm the car up. Jack it up and securely put it on axle stands at the rear with the front wheels securely chocked with bricks. Put the car in 3rd or 4th gear and run it up to about 70mph on the speedo with the wheels running free. Start by applying firm progressive pressure to the brakes with the clutch pedal depressed at the same time. If the clutch doesn't free up the engine may stall but keep perserveering and if necessary keeping the clutch pedal depressed stamp hard on the brake pedal (not for the faint hearted in a jacked up car ). This has always suceeded in freeing up even the most stubborn seized clutch on my GT6.
              Oh and I know this sounds like you need three legs (ala jake the peg) but really all you need to do is to put something in place to depress the clutch pedal, technical tip here, I use an old crooklock to wedge the clutch pedal down!!!

              • Clutch problem 

                Posted By : Michael Davis, 11-May-2004, 11:05am

                70mph? on axle stands? eek! Not sure I fancy that idea too much.

                • Clutch problem 

                  Posted By : Ian Mulford, 11-May-2004, 11:54am

                  Heck, me neither... I find it bad enough putting the car on axle stands without the engine running!
                  
                  Cheers!
                  
                  

                  • Clutch problem 

                    Posted By : Andy Cook, 11-May-2004, 03:05pm

                    I did say it's not for the faint hearted. They Key is to ensure that the car is very securely chocked so that it doesn't move on the stands. Could also be helped by the addition of some "no fear" stickers on to the car!

                    • Clutch problem 

                      Posted By : Jason Chinn, 11-May-2004, 07:23pm

                      Try standing next to car on a rolling road - I recall a Mk2 Jag on full bore doing an indicated 135 mph once - now that was frightening as it tried to climb the rollers! Glorious noise though
                      
                      Any other ideas for stuck clutches, a fellow member just called me to ask for advice, must be the season!

              • Clutch problem 

                Posted By : Philip Brammer, 11-May-2004, 05:04pm

                Don't fancy the axle stand bit but there again I'm a boring old fart! Always found either starting it up in 1st and then hitting the brakes (foot on clutch and leave room!) or else stick it in 1st and get some big beefy car to tow it off (with foot on clutch and ignition off obviously) has worked in the past.
                
                I have always used a small amount of James's copper grease on the splines when assembling. Will try yoghurt next time and feed back...hem hem.

        • Clutch problem 

          Posted By : Ian Knott, 24-Mar-2004, 10:04am

          Ben
          
          Changing the slave cylinder seals doesnt take long - it will probably takes longer to get the carpets and the gearbox cover out than to do the job itself!
          
          Rgds
          
          Ian
          
          '71 Mk4

          • Clutch problem 

            Posted By : Ben Duckett, 24-Mar-2004, 03:46pm

            I don't have carpets in my Spit; after being forced to watch endless episodes of Changing Rooms I snapped and replaced it with tasteful laminate flooring...

            • Clutch problem 

              Posted By : Mark Stradling, 25-Mar-2004, 10:08am

               

              
              
              Clutch problem

               

              • Clutch problem 

                Posted By : Michael Davis, 25-Mar-2004, 10:16am

                lol
                
                Does anyone else think there are too many photoshop experts on here with time on their hands
                

                • Clutch problem 

                  Posted By : Mark Stradling, 25-Mar-2004, 10:41am

                  The worst thing is - it actually started to look quite good to me after a while!
                  
                  ... and I've been meaning to replace the carpets in my car for a while now...

                  • Clutch problem 

                    Posted By : Michael Davis, 25-Mar-2004, 11:03am

                    

                    • Clutch problem 

                      Posted By : Ian Knott, 26-Mar-2004, 09:42am

                      Hang on, we could be onto something here!! No more worries with pulling carpets up to get at the gearbox - you can just fit a trap door instead

                  • Clutch problem 

                    Posted By : Ian Mulford, 25-Mar-2004, 03:08pm

                    What's next I wonder... dashboards from Habitat... seats by Ikea?
                    
                    Cheers!
                    

    • Clutch problem 

      Posted By : Tim Everitt, 23-Mar-2004, 05:32pm

      If there's no pressure when you put your foot on the pedal - then the first thing to check is the hydraulic system. Fill up the master cylinder and bleed the slave cylinder. If this doesn't give you some 'pedal' then look at a recent thread on this subject - it'll be in the archive. If you do have some 'pedal' then try the other ideas suggested earlier - but do be careful. I'm not sure you'll do much harm to the gearbox, but you can quite easily rip the friction material off the clutch plate. If trying the 'jab into gear' method, make sure you pick a gear that has some synchromesh on it.