Section : General

cellulose phasing out & EU regulations 

Posted By : Richard Paxman, 27-Mar-2006, 04:46pm

• cellulose phasing out & EU regulations 

  Posted By : Dan Owen, 27-Mar-2006, 07:59pm

  Everything I have seen on this seems to indicate that it will be a total ban, maybe some exeptions in very special circumstances
  but you can bet that won't include "backstreet mechanics pratting about with old bangers". This legislation is also going to outlaw most types of body filler and any solvent/oil based paint and thinners for the same. Sorry I can't provide any links but remember Google is your friend! To anyone who thinks "it won't be that bad, they won't go that far etc etc..." I would just say, remember the rules on how bendy bananas can be? The Eurocrats are past masters at thinking up batty rules and British Governments have a penchant for draconian enforcement of said batty rules.

• cellulose phasing out & EU regulations 

  Posted By : Richard Paxman, 28-Mar-2006, 12:31pm

  Hi Dan,
  Thanks for your reply. I can't seem to find much up to date information on this, but to me it seems to have potentially huge implications for home restorers ! I've looked at the FBHVC website, which doesn't seem to have much in the way of definite answers, though I have sent them an email, so hopefully I'll get a reply. I'm surprised I haven't seen more about this published in classic car magazines, or the 'Courier'. To me it seems as big a problem as the unleaded petrol issue... but maybe its just me ! Richard

  • cellulose phasing out & EU regulations 

    Posted By : Richard Paxman, 29-Mar-2006, 10:23am

    I am pleased to say I have had a very prompt response from the FBHVC regarding proposed cellulose regulations. This reply is reproduced below...
    
    "Following pressure from the historic vehicle movement, led in this instance by FBHVC, the EU directive that limits the proportion of Volatile Organic Compounds in paints and vehicle refinishing products allows national governments to permit the continued sale of "non-compliant" products on a special case, stricly controlled basis, for the proper repair/restoration of historic vehicles. The UK government has yet to publish the details of how it proposes to implement the controls, but it is committed to ensuring access
    
    Inevitably, the low volume of non-compliant product that will be sold will mean an increase in price as manufacturers will lose the benefits of bulk production. Many volume producers will simply switch to compliant product. The only manufacturer who has told us they will certainly continue to produce cellulose products is HMG Paints (www.hmgpaint.com) - why not buy the paint before 2007, just in case the government promise fails to materialise? The directive only limits sales, not use - so if you have bought before the implementation of the legislation, you can use it whenever you wish.
    
    And I have no objection to you sharing these remarks with anyone -
    
    Best regards,
    
    Jim Whyman.
    
    P H J Whyman, Secretary
    Federation of British Historic Vehicle Clubs Ltd "
    
    ..... so lets hope the government will be reasonable with their 'controls' and stay committed to providing access, so that it will continue to be available !
    
    Richard
    

    • cellulose phasing out & EU regulations 

      Posted By : Dan Owen, 29-Mar-2006, 02:03pm

      I am very doubtful. Our government takes a delight in hammering the motorist, especially it seems guys like us. The issue I think is going to be a lot bigger than the withdrawal of leaded petrol, I must say I have never come across anyone who has had a major problem with this as there are so many options availible, only problem is modern petrol is generally in my experience pretty poor quality. The "special case, strictly controlled" supply of non-compliant products will only be to those with special licences (or similar) to get one of these you will probably need a fully sealed spray booth with air extracion, proper filters etc etc. If not this then something equally ridiculous and unattainable, I would lay money on it (if I had any)!
      
      One thing I remember now from my researches, if you are caught using any sort of non-compliant product after the cut- off date, the onus will be on YOU to prove said product was purchased before the cut-off date.
      
      I hate to be so pessimistic about this, but I believe it to be THE biggest issue to date affecting the classic car movement. It is about time for individuals, clubs and the FBHVC to "Wake up and smell the coffee".

      • cellulose phasing out & EU regulations 

        Posted By : Danial Phoenix, 29-Mar-2006, 05:04pm

        time to stock up on ya cars coulor, worth 3 or 4 hundred of paint, thinnere,activator,laquer. keep a stock in just case,

        • cellulose phasing out & EU regulations 

          Posted By : Colin Lindsay, 29-Mar-2006, 05:29pm

          I take it Dan feels very strongly about this, with eight replies...!!
          It'll probably be one of these scaremonger stories with huge legal ramifications for anyone caught breaking the law, whereas in reality there'll be all sorts of people working on as before. Who's going to find the time to Police it?
          Remember the scare stories about home owners not being allowed to change their brake fluid anymore and having to go to 'experts'? Where did that one go to?
          Colin

          • cellulose phasing out & EU regulations 

            Posted By : Richard Paxman, 30-Mar-2006, 11:35am

            Hi again,
            
            Dan isn't the only one who feels strongly...
            I think the trouble this time is that our government has signed up to this EU directive on VOC's (Volatile Organic Compunds), directive 2004/42/CE ... (I believe) if anyone is interested !
            
            It does seem very unfair to people who will use so little so as not to make much difference to the environment, especially when compared to what the professional body repair shops must emit ! I'd really like to see more made of this (maybe officially by clubs ?), so that the government.. just might.. make any regulations or enforcement fair ... I guess we have no option but to wait and see !
            Richard

            • cellulose phasing out & EU regulations 

              Posted By : Dan Owen, 30-Mar-2006, 03:27pm

              Well I haven't a clue what I did there, pressed the wrong button or something... I only meant to post once, honest!
              
              I am stocking up. Believe the worst of these bastards and you will seldom be surprised

              • cellulose phasing out & EU regulations 

                Posted By : Andy Cook, 30-Mar-2006, 10:55pm

                There was a previous message board thread on this very subject in January this year:-
                
                http://www.tssc.org.uk/messageboard.asp?board=club...
                
                
                As I posted in the earlier thread:-
                
                "Solvant based paints are not being phased out. All that's happening is that regulations are being brought in to limit the VOC (Volatile Organic Compound) level in paints in 2007. Paints will still be available and for car restoration it's even possible to apply for a permit to allow use of paints that exceed the limits.
                
                Link to the government document on this:-
                
                http://www.defra.gov.uk/corporate/consult/vocs-tra...
                
                Other point to note is that these regulations are still draft and so may be watered down by the time they come in ....."
                

                • cellulose phasing out & EU regulations 

                  Posted By : Dan Owen, 31-Mar-2006, 01:03pm

                  The regulations may be watered down by the time they come in? Sorry but I can't believe that. Only thing that will be watered down is the godawful "compliant" paints when they wash off in the rain...

              • cellulose phasing out & EU regulations 

                Posted By : Nigel Gibbins, 31-Mar-2006, 01:20pm

                you can delete them you know... use the 'delete' link at the bottom of the posting.

                • cellulose phasing out & EU regulations 

                  Posted By : Colin Lindsay, 31-Mar-2006, 08:40pm

                  Volatile Organic Compounds... does that include alcohol? In which case, I must go stock up...
                  Colin

                  • cellulose phasing out & EU regulations 

                    Posted By : Dan Owen, 31-Mar-2006, 08:55pm

                    Nigel,
                    Ta. Duly noted as you can see