Anything and everything Herald. Talk about anything from the first 948s to the last 13/60s.

Hi everyone -this is my first posting, and I hope someone will be able to give me some advice. I bought an excellent 13/60 convertible a couple of years ago after a 25 year or so gap, having had a couple of Heralds and a couple of Spitfires in my youth! Car is all original, and has done approx 50k miles since new.

When I bought the car it kept jumping out of reverse and also the clutch juddered on starting off, so I replaced the gearbox, complete cluch and rear gearbox mountings.

The gearbox is now fine, but the clutch still judders on starting off, both forwards and backwards, unless revs are faily high and the clutch is 'dipped'. Runs as sweet as a nut the rest of the time.

I haven't replaced the front engine mountings, but these look fine, with no cracking of the rubber. I have also changed the clutch slave cylinder seal, following a leak.

The old clutch has a bit of 'circular' scoring on it, and as I recall, the flywheel had a similar level of scoring (haven't had another look yet!). There was also no sign of an oil leak onto the clutch.

All suggestions welcome -as this is spoiling an otherwise excellent car!

Martin

My clutch and flywheel had circular scoring on it - and it was juddering exactly like you mention.

Mine was found to be a bent engine back plate - which is dead easy to replace - just got to take the gearbox, clutch and flywheel off first.

Mine also shredded a couple of friction plates whilst it was juddering too - so if you're going along and hear a metalic explosion and your drive stops - that's what it'll be...

James

Now that the summer is well and truly over and the MOT has been successfully negotiated, it is time to fix my clutch judder!

I think I have eliminated the following:

1. Worn engine/gearbox mountings
2. Excessive engine endfloat
3. Oil/Grease on linings
3. Bent engine back plate (thanks for the suggestion James)

Clutch only judders when car well and truly hot (i.e. generally OK in winter). Bearing/linings/cover replaced approx 2,000 miles ago - did not make any difference.

I have now removed the gearbox/clutch again to have a closer look at the flywheel. The flywheel has a slight ridge at the outer edge of where the lining extends to, and is discoloured, although no deeply scored.

Before I go and replace/get skimmed the flyweel, does anyone think this could be the problem or have any further suggestions?

Thanks
Martin

Hi Martin,
The flywheel looks a bit rusty in the pictures. I know that digital flash photography can make the slightest bit of rust look far more red than it actually is, but it should be every bit as shiny as a brake disc in the area of contact with the clutch lining.
Cheers,
Bill.

Thanks Bill,

The flywheel IS as rusty as it looks in the picture!

Is this something that can be rectified without replacing/skimming the flywheel?

Also, as I have removed the gearbox/clutch with the engine still in the car, I cannot get enough leaverage on the flywheel nuts from inside the car to undo them - even with my gorgeous assistant holding a cold chisel between the starter ring teeth and the clutch housing studs to stop the flywheel rotating.

Am I wasting my time trying to remove the flywheel in this way?

Thanks
Martin

I used an electric impact wrench (&163;30 from Machine Mart) to remove my flywheel bolts - was very easy - and no real need to hold the flywheel as it "snaps" them off. You can't get a huge breaker bar on to them because the bulkhead is in the way.

Also - you said you've checked the flatness of the back plate - although your symptoms don't point directly towards it being bent (as its only when hot) - make sure you take it off and put it on something level to double check it really is flat. You may as well if your flywheel is coming off...

As for the rust - I would have thought it should be shiney where the clutch has been rubbing on it.

James

Something seems definitely wrong with your flywheel. It should definitely be shiny on the friction surface. IS it rust or some other contamination? Was it like this when you replaced the clutch plate last?
Although surface rust can form quickly, I note that other exposed metal and the rest of the flywheel is not rusty/contaminated in this way which is what makes me wonder if it IS rust. while you could try polishing it off with fine emery paper, I really would have expected light surface rust (which is all a clutch can really cope with) to have long since been polished off in normal clutch use.
Together with your comment about the flywheel surface being slightly worn (the ridge at the edge) I would recommend that the flywheel is replaced or machine flat again. However, at the very least, if the flywheel surface CAN be polished shiny again, and you are prepared to take the gearbox (and engine?) out again later, you could try cleaning the flywheel and putting everything back together and seeing what happens. But you are halfway there already so I would replace or skim the flywheel.
That does mean taking the flywheel off. While you SHOULD be able to undo the bolts in situ, everything becomes a lot easier if you take the engine out of the car. Remove the radiator first to give you more room to manouevre and prevent damaging the radiator core. (Replacing the clutch and attaching the gearbox is also a lot easier, but that of course needs a hoist or engine crane).
Having had a bent engine back plate and demolished the clutch plate myself, you can ONLY check for distortion with the flywheel off, and preferably the plate off and on a flat surface.

Having the engine securely mounted in the car makes flywheel removal considerably easier. Undoing the flywheel bolts requires the crankshaft to be locked, usually by having an assistant jam a large screwdriver between the upper gearbox locating studs on the back of the engine and into the ring gear. With the engine out of the car it also becomes necessary to prevent the block from being pulled over, from the torque applied to the bolts.
Cheers,
Bill.

hehe... ain't that the truth

I've just popped hte engine out of my van to regrind the crank and had to fight with a bucking engine block while trying to loosen flywheel bolts... whoaa, down boy, sit... stay.. etc

Eventually cracked it by strapping the block to the bench and ratcheting it tight... phew.... then pulled the crank and found I needed to get the pulley nut off too.... had to do it all over again.

I did win though.... in the end..

Would have been much easier if I'd have done it while the engine was in situ though...

(can't do that with the van tho') ... what fun

Section : Clutch

Clutch Judder

Followups :

Clutch Judder

Clutch Judder

Clutch Judder

Clutch Judder

Clutch Judder

Clutch Judder

Clutch Judder

Clutch Judder